16:59:26 <colindixon> #startmeeting tsc
16:59:26 <odl_meetbot> Meeting started Thu Oct 30 16:59:26 2014 UTC.  The chair is colindixon. Information about MeetBot at http://ci.openstack.org/meetbot.html.
16:59:26 <odl_meetbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
16:59:26 <odl_meetbot> The meeting name has been set to 'tsc'
16:59:34 <colindixon> #topic agenda bashing and roll call
16:59:36 <colindixon> #info colindixon
16:59:53 <colindixon> #chair regXboi
16:59:53 <odl_meetbot> Current chairs: colindixon regXboi
17:00:03 <kwatsen> #info Kent Watsen
17:00:38 <regXboi> #info regXboi
17:00:49 <regXboi> colindixon: did you #link the agenda?
17:01:02 <ChrisPriceAB> #info Chris Price
17:01:09 <colindixon> #link https://wiki.opendaylight.org/view/TSC:Main#Agenda
17:01:12 * ChrisPriceAB can scribe a bit too
17:01:18 <colindixon> #chair ChrisPriceAB
17:01:18 <odl_meetbot> Current chairs: ChrisPriceAB colindixon regXboi
17:01:30 <regXboi> wow a volunteer!  sign him up! sign him up!
17:01:46 * ChrisPriceAB haha
17:02:07 * ChrisPriceAB prepare for some good old fashioned "Australian English"
17:02:36 <colindixon> cdub: are you around?
17:02:42 <LuisGomez> #info Luis Gomez
17:03:13 <ChrisPriceAB> having some trouble getting onto webex
17:03:19 <mohnish> #info mohnish
17:04:37 <cdub> colindixon: yes, but can't join audio
17:04:46 <edwarnicke> #info edwarnicke
17:06:03 <jmedved> #info jmedved
17:06:31 <regXboi> #info it appears that action items (with the exception of master being stuck) have been addressed
17:06:42 <colindixon> #action gzhao and edwarnicke to continue to work on getting master (Lithium) auto-release back unstuck
17:07:00 <regXboi> #link https://meetings.opendaylight.org/opendaylight-meeting/2014/tsc/opendaylight-meeting-tsc.2014-10-23-16.59.html old action items
17:07:23 <regXboi> audio is old school :)
17:07:24 <colindixon> ChrisPriceAB, cdub: do you guys have audio yet
17:07:38 <ChrisPriceAB> no, having some trouble with our webex still.  soon to be there I hope
17:08:43 <colindixon> #topic new TSC members
17:09:01 <cdub> colindixon: i'm going to pass to flaviof
17:09:03 <flaviof> welcome Luis!
17:09:08 <edwarnicke> Welcome LuisGomez ! :)
17:09:08 <jmedved> welcome luis
17:09:14 <mohnish> welcome luis
17:09:15 <regXboi> #info regXboi welcomes luis
17:09:17 <colindixon> #info welcome LuisGomez to the TSC
17:09:26 <LuisGomez> thanks
17:09:30 <ChrisPriceAB> welcome luis
17:10:02 <regXboi> #info LuisGomez is replacing dmm as brocade's platinum member designate
17:10:57 <regXboi> #topic Updates
17:11:05 <regXboi> #info no updates on events
17:11:34 <regXboi> #info updates for system integration/testing and stable/helium both from Luis
17:12:29 <regXboi> #info plan to have proposal for integration/testing requirements my next TSC call
17:12:50 <regXboi> #info primary pain point continues to be infrastructure
17:13:34 <regXboi> #info all integration pieces for stable/helium are now complete - continuous testing of stable/helium is now ongoing
17:13:37 * regXboi cheers
17:14:20 <regXboi> #info there is a RC for stable/helium ....  status hopefully forthcoming in a linked email?
17:14:21 <colindixon> #link https://jenkins.opendaylight.org/odlautorelease/job/autorelease-helium-worker/ the job building helium stable pre-release
17:14:32 <regXboi> colindixon: thinks
17:14:36 <regXboi> er thanks :)
17:14:40 * regXboi doesn't think :)
17:16:29 <regXboi> #action gzhao/luis to send mail to discuss that the last day to have a patch merged to stable/helium is sunday 11/2.
17:16:36 <LuisGomez> #link https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1PYxjiSYEks44uJByVO1P44rnI5xTJRulpKyrSsDQF9g/edit#gid=1307630876
17:16:45 <LuisGomez> #info project status
17:16:55 <colindixon> #link https://lists.opendaylight.org/pipermail/release/2014-October/000777.html the mail saying when the final artifacts will be cut
17:16:56 <regXboi> #undo
17:16:56 <odl_meetbot> Removing item from minutes: <MeetBot.ircmeeting.items.Link object at 0x2524990>
17:17:00 <regXboi> ouch
17:17:05 <regXboi> #link https://lists.opendaylight.org/pipermail/release/2014-October/000777.html the mail saying when the final artifacts will be cut
17:18:32 <regXboi> #action gzhao to send email to release/discuss that stable/helium RC will be cut on monday and projects should test it and report as TSC will vote on that RC on next thursday's meeting
17:19:20 <colindixon> https://wiki.opendaylight.org/view/Simultaneous_Release:Cutting_Stability_Branches
17:19:32 <regXboi> #info question on what the completed through tab of project status means
17:19:42 <mohnish> lost audio
17:19:50 <regXboi> #info answer this how far through the cutting stabilty branches process
17:20:10 <regXboi> #link https://wiki.opendaylight.org/view/Simultaneous_Release:Cutting_Stability_Branches cutting stability branches process
17:20:23 <regXboi> yo: keith!
17:20:39 <regXboi> #chair alagalah
17:20:39 <odl_meetbot> Current chairs: ChrisPriceAB alagalah colindixon regXboi
17:20:55 <alagalah> regXboi: yeah... thanks
17:21:00 <flaviof> #link https://wiki.opendaylight.org/view/Simultaneous_Release:Cutting_Stability_Branches
17:21:11 <regXboi> #undo
17:21:11 <odl_meetbot> Removing item from minutes: <MeetBot.ircmeeting.items.Link object at 0x26215d0>
17:21:15 <flaviof> #undo
17:21:42 <alagalah> #action colindixon to talk to LF marketing around co-ordinating any PR around stable release (in a week)
17:22:04 <regXboi> #info no Creation Reviews and no Committer Promotions
17:22:34 <regXboi> #topic ovsdb splitting in two
17:23:01 <regXboi> do we need a #link?
17:23:06 <regXboi> of the email?
17:23:25 <ChrisPriceAB> #info Srini describes that the OVSDB project contains two components, north and southbound today.
17:24:14 <ChrisPriceAB> #info There is an ongoing discussion about splitting the project into two parts, he proposes a project called OVSDB plugin and openstack
17:24:20 <alagalah> would this require a scope (re-) definition?
17:24:22 * ChrisPriceAB I think
17:24:52 <regXboi> #info it is not clear that this discussion has been public ... i.e. we're still looking for public artifacts
17:25:06 <ChrisPriceAB> #info Colindixon states that any project can split any time prior to M3 of a release plan.  Pending creation reviews of the proprosed projects
17:25:21 <alagalah> ChrisPriceAB: I assume that scope definition would be part of that
17:25:37 * ChrisPriceAB yep, as part of the proposals to be approved
17:25:56 * ChrisPriceAB missed ed's statements.
17:26:26 <colindixon> ChrisPriceAB, alagalah: the current draft Lithium release plan requires that the split off projects to pass creation review normally, and thus would have scope discussion
17:26:55 <srini084> Thread: https://lists.opendaylight.org/pipermail/ovsdb-dev/2014-October/000750.html
17:27:12 <ChrisPriceAB> #info there is a patch planned for the openflowplugin project to include the "Nicira extentions" currently in OVSDB.
17:27:30 <regXboi> #link https://lists.opendaylight.org/pipermail/ovsdb-dev/2014-October/000750.html ovsdb split proposal thread
17:27:48 * ChrisPriceAB thanks regxboi
17:28:41 <edwarnicke> colindixon: Might it make sense to have a very *short* standing 'FYI' item on the agenda for folks to bring up things like this that aren't quite TSC business (yet) but folks think the TSC should know about
17:28:58 <colindixon> edwarnicke: yes, it does
17:29:56 <colindixon> #action colindixon to make the possibitliy of adding new topics for agenda bashing more explicit on the TSC agenda
17:30:03 <colindixon> #topic OPNFV
17:30:12 <regXboi> #link      https://www.opnfv.org/
17:30:53 <colindixon> #link https://wiki.opnfv.org/ the wiki (analogous to our OpenDayilght wiki)
17:33:14 <colindixon> #info OPNFV is about 1.5 months old and plans to work with “upstream” projects, e.g., in OpenStack and OpenDaylight to define an Open Platform for NFV
17:33:31 <colindixon> #info the intent is that most (maybe all) code will go to upstream projects
17:33:49 <colindixon> #info similar to ODL, there are open TSC meetings and feel free to join in
17:34:30 <colindixon> this is by far the quietest TSC meeting with edwarnicke on the call that I can remember
17:34:51 <regXboi> wow
17:34:56 <regXboi> did you really just type that?
17:35:03 <alagalah> ChrisPriceAB: Any tie in between opnfv.org and any ONF WGs ? Do you guys talk ?? Espec. re standards etc ?
17:36:00 <alagalah> ChrisPriceAB: ha ha
17:36:03 * alagalah Aussie joke
17:36:55 <alagalah> ChrisPriceAB: Thanks mate...
17:38:52 <ChrisPriceAB> Thanks colindixon, appreciate the opportunity to spread the word.  ;)
17:40:08 <ChrisPriceAB> Some might beg to differ edwarkicke!
17:41:09 <colindixon> #topic infrastructure update
17:41:19 <colindixon> #info there are templates in the releng/builder repo
17:41:40 <colindixon> #info projects that want want to try it out should contact Thanh
17:42:09 <colindixon> #action colindixon to add infrastucture to the list of deafualt update
17:42:18 <regXboi> #info the directories contain a readme that will allow early adopters to spawn a jenkins docker image and get started with jenkins builder
17:42:31 <alagalah> What is Thanh's IRC nick ?
17:42:50 <dfarrell07> alagalah: zxiiro
17:42:53 <tykeal> alagalah: zxiiro
17:43:47 <alagalah> ty
17:43:47 <alagalah> zxiiro: We need docker support in Jenkins etc in GBP so count us in as guinea pigs
17:44:31 <colindixon> zxiiro:
17:45:01 <colindixon> zxiiro: TTP is also a decent project, very simple
17:45:30 <colindixon> colindixon: asks if projects can be both in their jenkins silo and the new unified silo at the same time
17:45:50 <colindixon> #info colindixon asks if projects can be both in their jenkins silo and the new unified silo at the same time
17:46:55 <colindixon> #info the answer is that should be possible with a few possible quirks, for instance two jobs pushing to nexus from two places and two jobs voting in gerrit
17:47:45 <colindixon> #info colindixon volunteers TTP and alagalah volunteers GBP to participate
17:48:00 <regXboi> #info a question asked: "is there a target date for when projects that want to move should have moved?"
17:48:12 <regXboi> #info answer: no target date set as of now
17:49:07 <regXboi> #info skipping progress on technical debt/integration to ...
17:49:14 <regXboi> #topic lithium release plan
17:49:30 <zxiiro> alagalah: to be clear the docker image i mentioned is to start a local jenkins instance so that you can test Job builder against it. Not a jenkins instance that runs docker
17:49:43 <alagalah> zxiiro: Aaaahhhhh
17:49:50 <alagalah> zxiiro: Thanks for the clarification, mate
17:49:52 <regXboi> #link https://wiki.opendaylight.org/view/Simultaneous_Release:DRAFT_Lithium_Release_Plan_ckd
17:50:09 <colindixon> changes: https://wiki.opendaylight.org/index.php?title=Simultaneous_Release%3ADRAFT_Lithium_Release_Plan_ckd&diff=22026&oldid=21676
17:50:14 <regXboi> #info previous link is draft lithium release plan
17:50:33 <regXboi> #link https://wiki.opendaylight.org/index.php?title=Simultaneous_Release%3ADRAFT_Lithium_Release_Plan_ckd&diff=22026&oldid=21676 changes to draft plan
17:50:35 <edwarnicke> Does anyone mind if I change the main wiki page to link in https://wiki.opendaylight.org/view/Simultaneous_Release:DRAFT_Lithium_Release_Plan_ckd instead of the older one that is there currently?
17:50:54 <regXboi> edwarnicke: I'm ok with that
17:52:58 <regXboi> #info colindixon noticed that the last date for project joining is a friday, which doesn't quite line up with the thursday TSC schedule
17:54:07 * regXboi wonders if the TSC has hit the halloween candy early and is now on a sugar crash :)
17:59:29 <colindixon> yeah
18:00:29 <regXboi> #info discussion of API declaration at M1 between colindixon and edwarnicke
18:00:29 <regXboi> #undo
18:00:29 <odl_meetbot> Removing item from minutes: <MeetBot.ircmeeting.items.Info object at 0x26494d0>
18:00:29 <regXboi> #info discussion of API declaration at M2 between colindixon and edwarnicke
18:02:39 <regXboi> #action colindixon and edwarnicke to craft language around API declaration at M2 to achieve something useful but not overbearing
18:04:26 <colindixon> #link https://wiki.opendaylight.org/view/Simultaneous_Release:DRAFT_Release_Plan_2014_Template the per-project release plan template
18:04:33 <regXboi> #info question of what the default state should be.  colindixon feels that if all APIs are enunciated, default status is less important
18:07:25 <regXboi> #info point that the release plan template now includes a section to be filled out by other teams that see a dependency
18:10:51 <colindixon> #info edwarnicke asks if we should make it possible for external projects, e.g., OPNFV to make requests of projects as part of negotiation
18:10:52 <alagalah> I think this is wrong
18:11:10 <colindixon> alagalah: please speak up?
18:11:12 <alagalah> External folks should be doing this via the Project Lead, and the team updates the Release plan
18:11:16 <alagalah> I can't, no mike
18:11:55 <colindixon> alagalah: interesting thought, so is there a reason not to allow that to be documented in the same way as internal project requests?
18:11:59 <colindixon> I’m honestly not sure
18:12:11 <alagalah> Unless I am misunderstanding, a project's release plan should only be udpated by members of the project
18:12:23 <alagalah> What we are talking about is the flow of information.
18:12:26 <colindixon> dlenrow: asks if there should be an opnfv project to help with this
18:12:27 <colindixon> ah
18:12:29 <colindixon> I see
18:12:52 <colindixon> my thought was to only have one section that others opened to start and log a negotiatoin
18:12:54 <alagalah> Otherwise someone update's it, you as the project lead don't realise... and a 3rd party reads it and takes it as gospel
18:12:59 <colindixon> similar to the API execptoin project
18:13:04 <colindixon> process
18:13:05 <alagalah> Ok.... I was perhaps misunderstanding
18:15:02 <colindixon> #info dlenrow says his intent is to try to get OPNFV to create a project in ODL to manage this
18:15:04 <dfarrell07> huzzah @ upstream first
18:15:20 <colindixon> #info uri and edwarnicke point out that they really want to push the code into ODL directly
18:15:58 <colindixon> alagalah: did you follow the API exception process in Helium?
18:17:05 <alagalah> I missed the Request part...
18:17:17 <alagalah> Right, just creating a wiki-thing === danger
18:17:30 <alagalah> BTW I am mike-less ...
18:18:27 <colindixon> #action colindixon to add a note that you need to send a mail along with putting the request on the providing project’s release plan for API negotiation
18:18:45 <colindixon> #info abhijitkumbhare asks if we should use bugzilla to track these things
18:19:14 <colindixon> #info edwarnicke and colindixon say there should probabably be a way to link to a bug representing the request
18:21:55 <regXboi> #info next subtopic: should there be requirements sonar code coverage/quality beyond reporting
18:23:46 <regXboi> #info Jan represents his and robert's view that we should be having a requirement to ensure overall code coverage/quality
18:24:06 * colindixon picks up the pen
18:24:56 <colindixon> #info regXboi asks (1) what about non-java code? (2) it seems to make senes that we report it in Lithium with the express intent of requiring coverage and lack of findbugs Beryllium
18:25:20 <regXboi> #info colindixon agrees with everything Jan said (as does regXboi)
18:27:05 <colindixon> #info colindixon also notes that blind reaching for code coverage can do more harm than good
18:27:41 <colindixon> #info edwarnicke notes that he likes the principle of reporting first before requiring
18:29:09 <colindixon> #info edwarnicke also notes that code coverage is a double edge sword, all it does is tell you that some measured behavior of the code hasn’t changed, it can actually bake in bugs rather than find them
18:31:48 <colindixon> #info regXboi proposes the idea of encouraging the key infrastructure projects to voluntairly try to hit certain code coverage and findbugs in their projects
18:32:08 <colindixon> #Info jmedved, colindixon, and edwarnicke all say this sounds like the right approach
18:33:12 <regXboi> #info jmedved, colindixon, and edwarnicke all say this sounds like the right approach (apologies for double if that happens)
18:33:50 <colindixon> #info regXboi also adds that we should note that doing this will be viewed positively when it comes to moving along the lifecycle phases
18:34:40 <colindixon> #info flaviof asks if there’s a way to codify good logging processes as part of this and make that something we can encourage
18:35:26 <edwarnicke> #link https://wiki.opendaylight.org/view/Logging_Best_Practices
18:36:10 * regXboi raises hand
18:36:20 <colindixon> regXboi: you’re next
18:37:02 <colindixon> #info colindixon proposes maybe opening logging bugs, edwarnicke extends this to having a logging component in all projects so that we can track how bad the logging problem is as the bugs come in
18:37:23 <flaviof> edwarnicke; +1
18:37:28 <colindixon> #info regXboi asks if we start to tighten up the logging practices release, by release
18:41:09 <colindixon> #action colindixon to work with gzhao to try to get project to create logging components in each project
18:48:44 <colindixon> #info a debate about whether all the the features need to be KDC (known, doable, confirmable) before the release starts
18:48:48 <alagalah> Apologies, gotta drop
18:48:58 <colindixon> #info the key point seems to be around documentation requirements
18:52:29 <colindixon> #info edwarnicke is of the opinion that if it’s not KDC at the start of the release, it shouldn’t be required as part of this release plan
18:52:48 <colindixon> #info colindixon says that can be carried to an extreme where the release plan doesn’t ever start
18:53:41 <colindixon> #action colindixon to reach out to integration and documentation to write requirements ASAP
18:57:26 <colindixon> #info edwarnicke also wants to see a full 4 weeks between when we approve the release plan and M1
19:00:32 <colindixon> #info edwarnicke wants to see all the requirements explained clearly *before* we approve the release plan, and points out that the TSC has been bad at meeting deadlines to provide thing in the future
19:00:52 <colindixon> #action regXboi to create a draft version of documentation requirements for Lithium
19:01:53 <ChrisPriceAB> ty all.  evening from europe
19:03:22 <colindixon> #action colindixon to make sure we make it clear when the developer pre-milestone meeting
19:03:26 <colindixon> #endmeeting